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This page was first published online 9-2-2007
This page was last updated 1-17-2008
(Note: On this page, as throughout this website, the term "38 Super" refers to the 38 Super +P cartridge.)

Handloaders have the choice of using the standard semi-rimmed cases typical of the 38 Super cartridge or the rimless cases (see below) introduced some years back that are commonly used by competitive shooters in the "action" and "practical" shooting sports.

Conventional Semi-rimmed 38 Super Brass

The author has handloaded brass from the major U. S. manufacturers Federal, Remington and Winchester and has not noticed any obvious difference between them with respect to quality or case life. All give good service.

Factory ammunition from Federal, Remington and Winchester is typically loaded in nickel plated cases. Plain brass cases can be found from Remington and Winchester cases as components. Starline offers both plain brass and nickel plated cases as components.

Nickel plated cases tend to feed more reliably than plain brass cases because the nickel reduces friction (drag). Enhanced reliability has obvious benefits for ammunition that might be used for self defense. Some folks have said that the nickel plating is hard on reloading dies, including the carbide sizing die, and may shorten their life. Whether true or not, handloaders should not be very concerned with this since it would likely take many thousands of uses to produce significant wear on the dies. Moreover, reloading dies are not costly so even occasional replacement would hardly present a financial concern, especially if compared to the cost of the loading components used for those many thousands of handloads.

Fired Brass

Finding sources of fired cases can be challenging since this is not a commonly used cartridge. Case life is quite good with nearly all common brands of 38 Super brass depending on what pressure the cartridge is loaded to. Loading cases to high pressure reduces their life. One sign of long use and/or high pressure loads is that the primer pocket feels "loose" when seating primers. If the primer seems to "fall" in place with virtually no effort or can be easy pushed out, then the case should not be used. A loose primer can be blown out, or allow gas to escape past it producing hazards for the shooter and bystanders and can cause erosion of the gun's breech face.

Any cracked/split cases should be discarded.

Another factor affecting case life is how much the case bulges during firing. This depends on pressure, chamber dimensions and how much of the case is supported. Unsupported chambers (explained) expose more of the case near the head and cases can bulge significantly in this region when pressure is high. Excessive expansion here weakens the case (photo under construction). In some instances a visible crack is present (photo under construction). Excessively bulged cases should be discarded for safety reasons. Repeated resizing of bulged cases can leave a visible "ring" here as well (photo under construction). These cases should also be discarded since this is a potential sign of weakness at that point and can result in head separation.

In the author's experience, the 38 Super cases do not appear to grow in length with repeated use so they seldom if ever need to be trimmed.

American Ammunition 38 Super cases (headstamp A-MERC) are unique. The samples that the author has are very thin-walled in the anterior portion where the bullet is seated. Even after these cases are sized (Dillon size die), but before the case mouth is belled, a bullet will fall into the case for some distance. No other brand of cases that the author has used behave like this. These cases might require that the bullet is crimped to prevent bullet set-back (photo under construction). These cases might be an isolated lot, or common to this caliber. A-MERC brass in 45 ACP that the author has used have not demonstrated this characteristic. The author elected to not handload these specific 38 Super cases to avoid this type of problem altogether. Your experience may vary.

The Fiocchi brass (headstamp G.F.L.) appear to be thick walled and some users might find that they fit tight in the crimp die. They fit very tight in the author's Lee Factory Crimp die.

Virgin Brass

New cases are offered for retail by many manufacturers and might be available from your local sporting goods stores. Larger shooting supply stores and specialty sites sell 38 Super cases and are available by mail/phone/web order. Midway, Natchez Shooting Sports, and Ghost Holster are sites that the author is familiar with. Some of these sites also offer rimless 38 Super cases (see below).

Measurements

Actual measurements from some virgin (never loaded) 38 Super cases commonly available in the U.S. are shown in Table 1 and are compared to the SAAMI specifications. The accompanying figure shows the key to the measurements. There is some variation in case dimensions from one case to another even in the same batch. Of the small number of cases measured, the dimensions of cases made by the same manufacturer varied as much as .002 inches.

Table 1: 38 Super Measured Case Dimensions (inches)

Manufacturer
A
B
C
D
E
Remington Nickel
0.402
0.340
0.897
0.381
0.382
Remington Brass
0.400
0.340
0.900
0.381
0.381
Winchester Brass
0.401
0.343
0.897
0.380
0.379
Starline +P Nickel
0.400
0.341
0.896
0.380
0.379
SAAMI Specifications
0.406
0.345
0.900
0.384
0.384

Rimless 38 Super Brass

A new breed of 38 Super brass was born some years back that transformed the 38 Super into a rimless cartridge.  As the name suggests, the semi-rim was eliminated. The new rim diameter is close to the case wall diameter. On the samples measured, the rim was no more than .007 inches wider than the case wall diameter (in typical semi-rimmed cases the rim is roughly .020 wider than the case wall, see Table 1). The rimless cases are intended to headspace on the case mouth. If you have an older barrel, the rimless cases might slip farther into the chamber than the semi-rimmed cases.

One impetus for the development of rimless cases was that the semi-rimmed 38 Super case did not always feed reliably from double column magazines. Several companies make pistols (STI, SVI, EAA Witness), or their components (Caspian, Para Ordnance), that use double column 38 Super magazines. The rimless case improves feeding reliability in these magazines. These pistol designs are popular in practical shooting sports such as IPSC.  

Rimless cases are made by Starline (38 Super Comp; 38 TJ (TJ stands for Todd Jarrett)), Hornady (38 TJ), Lapua (38 Super Lapua) and Armscor (38 Super RL). No major U.S. ammunition manufacturer offers loaded ammunition in these cases, but one smaller manufacturer does (Atlanta Arms and Ammo). Table 2 denotes actual measurements made of some virgin 38 Super rimless cases that are commonly used in the U.S. The case rim and the extractor groove diameters are the only external dimensions that vary from the standard 38 Super case. Note that the "TJ" cases have a narrower extractor groove dimension than other rimless cases. As in Table 1, some dimensions vary from one case to another even in the same batch.

Table 2: Rimless 38 Super Measured Case Dimensions (inches)

Manufacturer
A
B
C
D
E
Starline 38 SC Nickel
0.386
0.329
0.897
0.380
0.380
Starline 38 SC Brass
0.386
0.329
0.895
0.379
0.379
Starline 38 TJ Brass
0.386
0.315
0.897
0.380
0.380
Hornady 38 TJ Brass
0.386
0.315
0.896
0.381
0.380
Lapua 38 Super Brass
0.381
0.331
0.892
0.381
0.379
SAAMI Specifications
0.406
0.345
0.900
0.384
0.384

SC = Super Comp. TJ = Todd Jarrett.

Rimless cases might also improve feeding reliability from single column magazines. The small semi-rim on normal 38 Super cases can increase the chance that a cartridge might nosedive during feeding because the semi-rim rubs on the underlying case and this enhances drag. Rimless cases reduce the drag (see nosedive feed failures under construction). But many shooters use the normal semi-rimmed cases in single column magazines with no feeding problems. The real benefit of rimless cases is in double column magazines, but even with these magazines some shooters have had good results with the semi-rimmed cases. The author experienced occasional feeding problems with the conventional semi-rimmed 38 Super cases in double column Para Ordnance pistols. Switching to rimless cases solved the problem.

Extractor Issues

Extractor Tuning for Rimless Cases

Because the rim is not as wide on rimless cases than normal 38 Super cases, the rim is, in effect, farther from the extractor. Consequently, the gun's extractor might require minor adjustment in order to assure reliable extraction of these cases from the chamber. But some extractors might work just fine with no need for adjustment. If you experience extraction problems with rimless 38 Super cases consult a qualified gunsmith for ways to remedy this problem. Often a slight increase in extractor tension solves the problem.

Aftec makes extractors for 1911 style pistols that are tuned specifically for either the standard semi-rimmed 38 Super cases or the rimless 38 Super cases. However, there are slight differences in the slide's breech dimensions depending on the manufacturer, so check with a qualified gunsmith for specifics if you consider buying one. Also note that some people have reported that Aftec extractors require tuning as well. The author uses conventional extractors with rimless cases with excellent result in his 1911s.

How Much Rim?

If you take a close look at the numbers in Tables 1 and 2, you can calculate the amount of the rim that the extractor has available to grab onto. The results are shown in Table 3.

Table 3: Effective rim of 38 Super Cases (inches)

A
B
A - B
Effective Rim
SAAMI
0.406
0.345
0.061
÷ 2 =
0.0305
Semi-rimmed
0.401
0.341
0.060
÷ 2 =
0.0300
38 Supercomp
0.386
0.329
0.057
÷ 2 =
0.0285
38 Todd Jarrett
0.386
0.315
0.071
÷ 2 =
0.0355
Lapua 38 Super
0.381
0.331
0.050
÷ 2 =
0.0250

SAAMI specifications indicate a rim of 0.0305 inches. Semi-rimmed cases come close to that and of those measured produced an average of 0.0300 inches. Rimless Supercomp cases offer a slightly smaller rim of 0.0285 inches. The TJ cases, with their narrower extractor groove waist, provide more rim for the extractor, at 0.0355 inches. The Lapua cases offer the least, with 0.025 inches.

The extractor groove of 38 TJ cases also extends farther forward than all other 38 Super cases. This provides more room for the head of the extractor.

References:

Speer Reloading Manual #13. 1998. Ed. Allan Jones. Blount, Inc. Sporting Equipment Division. Speer, Lewiston, ID.

ANSI/SAAMI booklet Z299.3-1993. American National Standard. Voluntary Industry Performance Standards for Pressure and Velocity of Centerfire Pistol and Revolver Ammunition for the Use of Commercial Manufacturers. 1993. Sporting Arms & Ammunition Manufacturers' Institute, Inc., Wilton, Conn. USA.
Questions, comments, suggestions, hate mail? Feel free to email me. However, the probability of getting a response is low simply because I have a day job and a life and don't have the time to respond to all emails. It's nothing personal, really. Nevertheless, I do appreciate your thoughts. If you see an obvious error then please put the word ERROR in the title of your email. Thanks, and happy shooting.
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